“I’m Behind In Leadership!”

Join Randy and Carmen this week as they discuss complexities of leadership through role play. It’s a series of conversations that will help you become a better leader – and a better employee.

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Podcast Transcript

  • Randy:  (music playing) Welcome to the Evolutionary podcast, I’m Randy Harrington.
  • Carmen:  And I’m Carmen Voilleque.
  • Randy:  And today, Carmen, we’re going to get into a role play,
  • Carmen:  That’s right.
  • Randy:  That really covers the bases on very fundamental leadership issues, but we see it happening all the time, every day.
  • Carmen:  That’s right. And we wanted to have a little fun with it.
  • Randy:  And just, instead of just talking about it, we thought–
  • Carmen:  Yeah.
  • Randy:  What the heck, we’ll show what it actually looks like.
  • Carmen:  So we’re going to kick off this first conversation, this is a VP named Roger.
  • Randy:  Roger, he is the VP of marketing.
  • Carmen:  That’s right. And Roger has 3 managers, all women, who work for him. Ally.
  • Randy:  OK.
  • Carmen:  And Ally is a bonding communicator.
  • Randy:  OK.
  • Carmen:  Very relationship oriented, so,
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  Here is Roger’s conversation with Ally.
  • Randy:  And see if you can hear what kind of communicator Roger is.
  • Carmen:  All right. Here we go. (music) Hey Roger, how you doing?
  • Randy:  Hey, I’m doing great. Great to see you, Ally.
  • Carmen:  Thanks. I, I was just wondering if you had a couple seconds.
  • Randy:  Oh, you bet. For you, anytime.
  • Carmen:  Oh, thank you so much.
  • Randy:  You look terrific today, incidentally, ah, you just–
  • Carmen:  Really?
  • Randy:  You must be working out or something, you just–
  • Carmen:  Oh, well, this shirt is new.
  • Randy:  Yeah, maybe that’s it, but anyway.
  • Carmen:  Wow, thanks, Roger.
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  You look good too.
  • Randy:  Well, thanks.
  • Carmen:  I was going to ask you about your dog, too.
  • Randy:  Oh.
  • Carmen:  Because I know you’ve had–
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  You know, some things going there.
  • Randy:  Doing a lot better, thanks.
  • Carmen:  Really?
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  Well good.
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  Good, I bet you’re happy about that.
  • Randy:  It was a close one, no doubt about it.
  • Carmen:  Yeah, yeah. Well hey, I just wanted to talk with you really quickly about project Blue Sky Go Live.
  • Randy:  (laughing) Oh, yeah, oh, yeah.
  • Carmen:  You know, we call it the BS Team.
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  OK.
  • Randy:  Boy, the BS Team is rockin’.
  • Carmen:  Yeah, well so, you know, I and I do think they are rockin’, I think that’s a great, a great way to put it and I feel pretty good about it, but you know, in this last meeting, I don’t know, it just seems like things were just like a little off balance.
  • Randy:  Hmm.
  • Carmen:  Maybe just some.
  • Randy:  Really?
  • Carmen:  You know how you get that feeing,
  • Randy:  Yeah, sure.
  • Carmen:  That maybe something’s just not quite right.
  • Randy:  No, you have good instincts for these things.
  • Carmen:  Going on behind the scenes, so.
  • Randy:  Yeah. It’s all about intuition.
  • Carmen:  Yeah, so I’m not, I’m not sure,
  • Randy:  OK.
  • Carmen:  If I’m right about this, but, you know, I just, I thought I should talk to you about it. Ah, but, anyway, what’s going on with the team [00:02:00] right now is that the folks from IT and sales.
  • Randy:  Uh-huh. Oh, yeah, good folks.
  • Carmen:  Ah, they made a big pitch in our last meeting it was pretty cool.
  • Randy:  Oh, yeah.
  • Carmen:  I was really,
  • Randy:  They are really,
  • Carmen:  I mean, they were so dynamic.
  • Randy:  They are buttoned up.
  • Carmen:  They are and ah, people were wowed. I mean, I was wowed.
  • Randy:  Really.
  • Carmen:  I was, yeah, it was pretty cool.
  • Randy:  I’m sorry I wasn’t there.
  • Carmen:  Yeah, yeah, well.
  • Randy:  It’s that whole dog thing, you know.
  • Carmen:  You know, you know you should feel free to drop in any time, actually.
  • Randy:  Yeah, I think I probably should.
  • Carmen:  You know everybody, yeah–
  • Randy:  I don’t want to mess things up though, you know.
  • Carmen:  Well yeah, that’s true, but you know everybody likes you, so. I think, well, anyway, think about, you know, if it just comes up, you always could drop in there. Ah–
  • Randy:  But anyway, you’re not feeling good about what’s going on there, because–
  • Carmen:  Well, you know, I just,
  • Randy:  Because
  • Carmen:  I almost got a sense that maybe Barbara and Lyn were, I don’t know they were just kind of quiet.
  • Randy:  Really?
  • Carmen:  And um, yeah, you know.
  • Randy:  They’re never quiet. Yeah, hmm.
  • Carmen:  They usually aren’t and um,
  • Randy:  OK.
  • Carmen:  Well, you know I just got that kind of a feeling,
  • Randy:  All right.
  • Carmen:  But I do think that, ah, that, you know, the idea is great. I guess if I were to say just one little concern I have about it,
  • Randy:  Sure.
  • Carmen:  It might be, um, you know, they’re asking us to do basically three things.
  • Randy:  Mm-hmm.
  • Carmen:  Um, they want to build an app.
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  For the new product that’s coming out.
  • Randy:  Love the app idea.
  • Carmen:  Apps are great.
  • Randy:  Apps are great.
  • Carmen:  And you know that’s what it’s all about today.
  • Randy:  It’s the kids with the apps.
  • Carmen:  Everybody with the apps.
  • Randy:  Everybody has an app.
  • Carmen:  So, we know we need that and they want to increase social media engagement.
  • Randy:  It’s what it’s all about.
  • Carmen:  And they want to hold an event. And of course, you know, for us in marketing, me and Barbara and Lyn, you know we’re always,
  • Randy:  That’s it.
  • Carmen:  Thinking about those things.
  • Randy:  That’s what we do, we’re on it.
  • Carmen:  That’s what we do. And I guess that’s it for me, is I’m concerned that maybe we’re not going to get any credit because, you know and I don’t mean to say, like, oh, we have to get all the credit all the time or anything like that.
  • Randy:  Yeah, well.
  • Carmen:  We’re part of the team. But, I just worry that, you know, that we might end up doing all the work and they pitched it and so, there you go.
  • Randy:  Ally, I, first of all, thanking you for bringing this to me. And I really appreciate your intuition. I think that, ah, I really trust your, your sensibilities about these things and what I’m going to do is, I, [00:04:00] did you ever see that TV show, My Favorite Martian? Where the guy has the antennae that come up out of his head? Woop! No you’re, you’re too young for that. But they did, there was a TV show. Woop! The antennae would come right up. I’m going to put my antennae up.
  • Carmen:  OK.
  • Randy:  Is what I’m going to do.
  • Carmen:  OK.
  • Randy:  And I’m going to be listening.
  • Carmen:  OK.
  • Randy:  Carefully. I’m going to be dialed into this issue.
  • Carmen:  OK.
  • Randy:  And then you and I can circle back and we’ll figure out what to do.
  • Carmen:  Yeah, yeah. OK, thats great. I like that.
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  That sounds good.
  • Randy:  You just, you keep going Ally, you’re doing great.
  • Carmen:  All right. Awesome. Thanks a lot, Roger.
  • Randy:  Thank you, thank you!
  • Carmen:  Bye-bye.
  • Randy:  All right.
  • Carmen:  (music) Now here’s Roger’s second conversation with the second manager, Barbara. And Barbara is a situational communicator.
  • Randy:  That’s right. And if you couldn’t figure it out in the first one, Roger is clearly a bonding style.
  • Carmen:  He’s clearly bonding, so.
  • Randy:  So you’re going to hear a situational person talking to a bonding person and let’s see how that plays out.
  • Carmen:  All right. Here we go. (music) Hey Roger, um do you have a second?
  • Randy:  Sure, Barbara, what’s up?
  • Carmen:  Well, I noticed I saw on your calendar that you have a meeting in about 10 minutes–
  • Randy:  Yes.
  • Carmen:  So, is this really, this is OK, cuz I didn’t schedule ahead of time, so.
  • Randy:  It’s just fine, it’s just fine, I’m glad you popped in. I’ve got 10 minutes and those 10 minutes are yours.
  • Carmen:  Awesome. OK.
  • Randy:  I have an open door policy, you know that.
  • Carmen:  Well, yeah.
  • Randy:  The door is always, the door is always open, I say.
  • Carmen:  I do, ah, you do say that, and I really appreciate that, um, but you know I just, I never wanna, you know, um, take advantage of that and so,
  • Randy:  Well, I certainly appreciate that.
  • Carmen:  So I just think it’s right to let people know. But thank you for, um, letting me have this 10 minutes, so, let me jump right in here. You know, we just had the project Blue Sky Go Live.
  • Randy:  The BS Team, yeah, love the BS Team.
  • Carmen:  The BS, yeah, well, I’m not exactly sure that that name is appropriate, um.
  • Randy:  Well, it’s Blue Sky, Blue Sky.
  • Carmen:  Yeah, but I mean, BS,
  • Randy:  I like that feeling, too.
  • Carmen:  You know people kind of assign a different meaning, but, it’s fine. Anyway, everybody on the team thinks it’s funny and so, I guess we can use that. But I do think we should stick to the names, you know, too, I mean.
  • Randy:  Blue Sky.
  • Carmen:  Yeah, Blue Sky.
  • Randy:  Blue Sky.
  • Carmen:  Anyway.
  • Randy:  I think that’s a good call, Barbara [00:06:00]. Blue Sky. Blue Sky.
  • Carmen:  Well, I just think it’s something that everybody needs to be sensitive to, when these project teams, they choose their name, it’s a big deal to go through that process of choosing the name. It’s really important for the team and the bonding.
  • Randy:  It needs to be important.
  • Carmen:  And I think we just don’t want to diminish it, and, and I’m not saying we are here. I’m just saying just, you know, something to be careful of.
  • Randy:  Good call.
  • Carmen:  But anyway.
  • Randy:  You’re always looking out for me, Barbara.
  • Carmen:  Um, well, I try. Anyway, um, so what’s going on is we just had a meeting and the IT and sales group presented an idea,
  • Randy:  Yeah, oh, I heard about that.
  • Carmen:  Yeah.
  • Randy:  I heard they knocked it out of the park.
  • Carmen:  Well, I mean, I think it was a polished presentation.
  • Randy:  Mm-hmm.
  • Carmen:  You know and they–
  • Randy:  They, you know what they’ve got, they’ve got transitions in the slides. I love that. I love that when it, it like fades or flips from one slide to the next.
  • Carmen:  Yeah.
  • Randy:  It kind of keeps the whole presentation moving.
  • Carmen:  Yeah. I know you really do like that. Anyway, so they, they presented these ideas and they did have data to back it up um, that they are going to do an app with a vendor.
  • Randy:  Apps. Apps are big, the kids love the apps.
  • Carmen:  Yeah, and so they’re going to use Pinwheel, um vendor for that and then basically they had 2 other things they want to do, increase social media engagement.
  • Randy:  Mm-hmm, Mm-hmm.
  • Carmen:  And then they want to hold a big event in November.
  • Randy:  Big event. [Crosstalk 00:07:22] everbody together.
  • Carmen:  Which should be setting off a little bit of a red flag for you because you know, November.
  • Randy:  November?
  • Carmen:  Is, well we have 5 other project teams running at the same time. They’re all going to be trying to close out at those times and closing out on time and having the dinner,
  • Randy:  OK. All right.
  • Carmen:  That we always have with all the senior team present at each one is really important, you don’t want to.
  • Randy:  Yeah, yeah, OK.
  • Carmen:  Push those back.
  • Randy:  I’m, I’m writing notes here as you’re talking.
  • Carmen:  OK. Well I have notes actually, so if you just want me to send you mine.
  • Randy:  Yes, oh, send, boy notes.
  • Carmen:  I have.
  • Randy:  Send them, send them on, Barbara.
  • Carmen:  OK, I will will, right after we’re, we’re done with this meeting. I’ll send those right over to you. But anyway, I think [00:08:00] that the big thing that, that’s wrong here is that they did not talk with us, I mean if you, you look all, all of these pillars have to do with marketing.
  • Randy:  Mmm.
  • Carmen:  And the first time that we heard any of this was actually in that project meeting. And I don’t really know what Lyn and Ally are thinking.
  • Randy:  You wanted to know ahead of time, yeah, I understand that.
  • Carmen:  Well, I, I think that it’s not just that we want to know ahead of time, but that, you know, it’s important for the project process, that the teams that are related to the work be informed ahead of time and included in the project development phase of that part of the pitch.
  • Randy:  That, you know, that’s an important thought right there.
  • Carmen:  And I think this is just another example of the way that we’re sort of letting the project process in our company erode. And I really think what–
  • Randy:  We can’t have that, we depend on that process.
  • Carmen:  Well, and, and it’s a very important process that’s in, in a big piece of our culture and so I think that at the next management meeting, you should propose that we have another project management training refresh.
  • Randy:  Wow. That is bold. Bold.
  • Carmen:  I really think it’s needed. And this is just one example of what happens when that process erodes.
  • Randy:  Barbara being bold. Love it. I think it’s a great idea.
  • Carmen:  Thank you.
  • Randy:  You know what I’m going to do? I’m going to have a little talk with–
  • Carmen:  Yeah, and I’ll send you the notes.
  • Randy:  Yeah, yeah.
  • Carmen:  So you can use them.
  • Randy:  When I bring the senior team together we’ll have a conversation about, I liked your word too, refresh.
  • Carmen:  Yeah.
  • Randy:  Refresh. It sounds good. Hey, Barbara, you are awesome.
  • Carmen:  Thank you.
  • Randy:  You popped in, you gave me the news I needed to hear and you gave me some ideas. Don’t say BS Team, I remember that, see?
  • Carmen:  Right.
  • Randy:  I was listening, I was paying, it’s Blue Sky.
  • Carmen:  So, so your, your senior team meeting, that’s on Thursday, right?
  • Randy:  Senior team meeting is, ah, I, I don’t, I think it is on Thursday, we’ve been changing it around a little bit.
  • Carmen:  Ok.
  • Randy:  But we’re going to bring it up at the senior team meeting.
  • Carmen:  OK.
  • Randy:  And we’re going to talk about ah, here I have it written down,  a refresh.
  • Carmen:  OK. Well maybe I’ll just send you a calendar item for Friday, um [00:10:00], you know, for like maybe 15 minutes and I can just check in with you and see how that decision goes.
  • Randy:  Open door. Open door, Barbara, you bet.
  • Carmen:  OK. OK, thanks Roger. Bye-bye. (music) And last, Roger is going to have a conversation with his third manager, Lyn.
  • Randy:  Lyn.
  • Carmen:  And Lyn is a direct communicator.
  • Randy:  She’s gonna tell it like it is.
  • Carmen:  And she doesn’t need much time.
  • Randy:  And she doesn’t need much time. And of course, Roger is going to continue to try and bond with Lyn. So let’s ah, let’s listen to this.
  • Carmen:  (music) Hey, Roger, you got a couple seconds?
  • Randy:  Um, heading out to a meeting.
  • Carmen:  I mean it’s just going to take like 2 minutes.
  • Randy:  OK, I, yeah.
  • Carmen:  Actually, how about I’ll just walk you to the meeting.
  • Randy:  That’d be great, Lyn, that’d be great.
  • Carmen:  OK. Um, it’s, it’s not going to take any time. I just need to tell you that at the recent BS Team meeting.
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  Perfect name, by the way, BS Team. I gotta tell you, it’s a freaking team, I don’t know why.
  • Randy:  (laughing) I know, I cracked up when I heard that.
  • Carmen:  Every freaking thing has to be a team.
  • Randy:  I know. No.
  • Carmen:  Just, you know, anyway.
  • Randy:  We’re team people.
  • Carmen:  So, here’s a point, here’s a really good reason why that doesn’t work. Yesterday.
  • Randy:  OK.
  • Carmen:  IT and Sales?
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  They go and pitch. We gotta do 3 things they say. Oh, we gotta build an app for the new product.
  • Randy:  Yeah, build an app, we gotta have.
  • Carmen:  More social media. And then hold an event, are you kidding me? With another event right now.
  • Randy:  And event, it’s an event.
  • Carmen:  So, it’s ridiculous. And you know who’s gonna have to do all that work?
  • Randy:  Ah.
  • Carmen:  Marketing.
  • Randy:  Marketing, marketing, yeah.
  • Carmen:  Yeah, marketing. Us, you know, but do they ever mention us? No. And I can tell you another thing.
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  Pinwheel? This vendor?
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  You remember we used them 2 years ago?
  • Randy:  Um.
  • Carmen:  Fail.
  • Randy:  Oh, really?
  • Carmen:  Epic fail.
  • Randy:  Oh.
  • Carmen:  Epic fail.
  • Randy:  I knew I had heard that name.
  • Carmen:  So, Pinwheel, it’s just, it’s just ridiculous, so this is a colossal error.
  • Randy:  Ok.
  • Carmen:  It’s colossal. And you need to fix it.
  • Randy:  I need to fix it?
  • Carmen:  You need to fix it. It’s hurting the company. There’s no accountability for this project team. And, you know, you’re the perfect guy to step in because it is, it’s all marketing. It’s all gonna be marketing.
  • Randy:  Yeah, you’re, yeah.
  • Carmen:  So, we need you to step up because, you know, Ally, Barbara and I, we have so much on our plates already.
  • Randy:  Right. You do. You’re busy people. Yeah.
  • Carmen:  And we’ve knocked out 3 home runs in the last quarter.
  • Randy:  Right.
  • Carmen:  You know, our team is performing [00:12:00], and you just really got to have our back on this. We can’t, we cannot do this right now.
  • Randy:  Ah, Wow. Ah, that’s really a lot for me to think about, but I, I appreciate you, ah, just, you know, kind of laying it right out there. You know what, let’s, let’s get back together again, end of the week and maybe we can close the loop on this.
  • Carmen:  OK, but you hear what I’m saying, right? I mean–
  • Randy:  You are clear as a bell, Lyn, always are (laughs). Don’t have to, don’t have to–
  • Carmen:  And you can see, I mean, you can see, I know you gotta go in this meeting, but you can see my point, right?
  • Randy:  Well, they don’t call it the BS team, for, for nothing.
  • Carmen:  Right.
  • Randy:  That’s all I’m saying.
  • Carmen:  Right, yeah, well, I knew you felt that way.
  • Randy:  (laughs) Yeah, as soon as I heard that name I was like, oh my god, that’s perfect.
  • Carmen:  Yeah, right, OK, cool. Well I can see, I can see you get what I’m saying Roger, so, thanks a lot, Roger.
  • Randy:  Yeah, I get it, oh yeah, high-five.
  • Carmen:  I really appreciate it. High-five. All right. See you later.
  • Randy:  (music) All right.
  • Carmen:  Well, three very different, ah,
  • Randy:  So, that was interesting, that was interesting, we,
  • Carmen:  The VP,
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  You got 3 very different employees there.
  • Randy:  I got 3 different employees. So we had ah, Ally come in first.
  • Carmen:  Yep.
  • Randy:  And so what was the deal with Ally? She was just all smooth, she was all butter, she was compliments and whatnot.
  • Carmen:  For those of you who have read our Evolutionaries book, we would call Ally a bonder.
  • Randy:  She is a bonding fool.
  • Carmen:  She’s a classic bonder.
  • Randy:  She came and she wanted to make sure, asking me about the dog, oh my goodness.
  • Carmen:  And great employee, super positive, silver lining around everything.
  • Randy:  But I really had no idea what she was actually saying. At the end of the day, I couldn’t tell what was really,
  • Carmen:  Great conversation.
  • Randy:  Really bugging here. I knew she was, there was something wrong, but.
  • Carmen:  You’ve not sure exactly what she wants you to do.
  • Randy:  Yeah. And let’s understand that in this scenario, the VP was also a bonder.
  • Carmen:  (laughs) Big bonder.
  • Randy:  So he’s saying everything that the person speaking to him wants to hear.
  • Carmen:  So they both leave that conversation feeling really great about the conversation.
  • Randy:  Even though the odds of anything actually happening from it are zero.
  • Carmen:  Right.
  • Randy:  Right.
  • Carmen:  But Ally could believe,
  • Randy:  Oh, sure.
  • Carmen:  Based on what Roger said, that,
  • Randy:  Yeah, Ally thinks that she’s done her job.
  • Carmen:  That, that, ah, yeah.
  • Randy:  And that was probably a bold conversation for her. She had to probably really stir up her confidence to go in and have that conversation [00:14:00]. And then we have Barbara.
  • Carmen:  OK, so let’s move on to Barbara. Barbara’s our classic situational communicator.
  • Randy:  Yeah. Immediately talking about times, how much times,
  • Carmen:  Process.
  • Randy:  Process, rules and roles.
  • Carmen:  Rules, roles.
  • Randy:  Yeah. And she’s wanting to make sure we’re all following the rules and if we’re not following the rules, big trouble.
  • Carmen:  Big trouble, and you know, people aren’t following the rules and if people would, you know, stick to their roles and follow the process then everything would run really smoothly and the organization would have a strong culture and everybody would be clear about what they’re supposed to be doing.
  • Randy:  Yeah. And, you know, the VP clearly had trouble with her because he didn’t want to be pinned down in all of those ways, bonding people–
  • Carmen:  He was a slippery fella.
  • Randy:  Bonding people don’t want to be pinned down, don’t, don’t,
  • Carmen:  And Barbara had clearly a lot of problems with Roger, too, but she’s not very direct about expressing them.
  • Randy:  Well, right, ah, that, that’s being on the record with face threatening acts or confrontational communication is just not OK for her. That’s part of her modality for communication is, I’m going to do anything to avoid conflict.
  • Carmen:  So, Roger’s bonding like crazy with her, though, he’s trying to make everything work out.
  • Randy:  Yep.
  • Carmen:  We see honor her style and everything and so she leaves that conversation, she could very well think that Roger’s gonna go swinging into the ah, Senior team meeting,
  • Randy:  Absolutely.
  • Carmen:  And uphold the process and the rules and the roles and–
  • Randy:  And the truth of it is, the reason Roger brought that up in the first place is so that he’ll have a way out. So that he’ll be able to say, oh, you know, I brought it up at the senior team meeting and we, you know, we just have a full calendar for training and I don’t think we can actually do this. So he’s already looking for escape hatches in his conversation with, with Barbara. And then–
  • Carmen:  Yes. And then there’s Lyn.
  • Randy:  Lyn.
  • Carmen:  I like Lyn.
  • Randy:  Straight to the, you know, this is, [crosstalk 00:15:41].
  • Carmen:  You’re gonna, you know what Lyn thinks.
  • Randy:  Yeah. Ah, this is stupid and it needs to stop and you need to be the one to do it.
  • Carmen:  Lyn is a direct communicator and ah, so she, yes, very good about not only explaining what she thinks is wrong but asking for what she wants.
  • Randy:  Right. And as long as Roger and Lyn can find some common ground [00:16:00], like the BS Team was the example in there,
  • Carmen:  Yep, yep.
  • Randy:  Then every, then, then Roger’s fine and he believes everything’s OK,
  • Carmen:  Yeah.
  • Randy:  Because there’s one little element of common ground, even though, again, the odds of him actually doing anything about this problem are,
  • Carmen:  Right.
  • Randy:  Next to zero.
  • Carmen:  So Roger’s pretty common, actually, um, we titled this podcast, “I’m Behind in Leadership”.
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  And this is really a, an issue where you have these leaders that are great listeners, great bonders, you know, Ally, Ally, Barbara and Lyn like him. They like him enough to go to him.
  • Randy:  Often just–
  • Carmen:  They felt affirmed.
  • Randy:  Really good people, exactly, ah, and the challenge for the bonding style leader is to cultivate the capacity to have that direct communication style. You know, for example, his message to all 3 of these people should have been, we’re working a process with the project teams, here’s the guidance we’ve given the project teams, if we want to change something, we need to change the guidance or change the charters but we’re not gonna to change what’s happening now. In other words, he needed to stand for what they’re standing for with respect of these project teams and be clear about it, instead of capitulating through the whole thing.
  • Carmen:  Yeah. And we don’t know what Roger would do next, but I suspect that what Roger will not do is circle wagons back around and say, hey, Ally, Barbara and Lyn, let’s all meet together and talk about this.
  • Randy:  No. He doesn’t want those worlds to collide, you know.
  • Carmen:  Right.
  • Randy:  At any, at any level.
  • Carmen:  But the, the sneaky little, dirty secret is that these managers talk to each other all the time anyway. And so, now that he,
  • Randy:  (laughs) Yeah. He’s doomed and he doesn’t even know it.
  • Carmen:  He’s doomed and he doesn’t know it because he’s had a pretty good conversation with each of them, but now they are going to go and compare notes.
  • Randy:  Yeah.
  • Carmen:  And they each think that they got something different out of that conversation. It will come back around to Roger.
  • Randy:  I, I think you could be right. So, our point here in this particular podcast was to just show what it sounds like. And you’re going to hear these conversations in the workplace, you’re gonna hear people, you know, being bonding, ah, style communicators, ah, people that are very [00:18:00] conventional, ah, wanting to, to really structure rules and roles and you’re gonna hear people ah, being direct and they, all 3 of those styles work, but, ah, they each have their ups and downs. And so, the more aware you are of them and the more direct you can be, ah, the better off.
  • Carmen:  And the more inclusive you can be in communicating with your team.
  • Randy:  Yeah, the big, the big thing that the research tells us is that you will succeed in communicating with any of these communication style types if you put your motives on the table. If you say way, then you’re likely to have much more influence  in the situation. Whether you’re Ally or Barbara or Lyn or whether you’re the, the VP, just way why. Why is this important? And you’re gonna gain a lot more influence.
  • Carmen:  So there you have it, our role play of the day, “I’m Behind in Leadership”.
  • Randy:  We certainly enjoyed it, yes, “I’m Behind in Leadership.” You’ve got a blog post coming out about the same title, but that’s got a very different take on it, it’s ah, some interesting discussions with your daughter.
  • Carmen:  That’s right.
  • Randy:  Ah, looking forward to that and ah, look for it on our website. And ah,
  • Carmen:  areyouevolutionary.com
  • Randy:  areyouevoluationary.com
  • Carmen:  And please join us next time (music) on Evolutionary’s podcast.